Corpusfishing.com

[Tyler]

David asked that I post this to see what you folks had to say about possibly raising the limits on Redfish and Trout.

Science and culture influence TPW rules
Numbers might support redfish bag limit of four
By David Sikes (Contact)
Thursday, May 21, 2009

CORPUS CHRISTI — To my satisfaction, science was behind each change to our fish and game regulations that I’ve endorsed over the years.

And each of these reasonable measures represented a tightening of privileges, from the no-plow rule within the seagrass protection area near Rockport to the five-trout limit for the Lower Laguna Madre.

Conversely, I did not favor the recent garfish rule, which goes into effect in September. The state went from zero restrictions to a one-fish daily limit. The science simply wasn’t there for this one.

There was no Power Point presentation with charts and graphs showing a decline in relative abundance, habitat degradation, a steady rise in harvest rates or poor recruitment.

There’s a reason I place so much stock in biology. Simply put, I lack the arrogance required to reject years of research in favor of a selfish hunch, a gut feeling or any level of casual observation, regardless of the amount of time this observation spans. Anecdotal information can be helpful and even convincing, but rarely does it trump conclusions based on scientific method.

But when it comes to the management of game and fish, science is not everything. While some of you may disagree that most TPW policies are driven by overwhelming evidence, this is not the sole consideration for management strategies. The folks at Texas Parks & Wildlife also are in the people management business. Sometimes culture plays a role in their decisions.

Look at some of the new deer regulations. Wildlife managers at TPW are following culture with regional harvest restrictions aimed at creating bigger bucks in East Texas. This was not about sustaining the species. Deer are not in trouble there.

The same goes for the 25-inch trout rule, which restricts us to a single trophy size trout as part of our daily bag. This was a direct result of an angling culture with a growing desire for big specks.

Well what if TPW consulted culture and biology to loosen bag limits. What if they proposed to add a redfish or a black drum to our stringers. Would we accept this?

The science is there. For years, they’ve been telling us that redfish populations are climbing, despite increasing pressure. In some cases, redfish stocks are outpacing harvest rates.

And in the Upper Laguna Madre, they say we have nearly five times more black drum than we do trout. Why is it then that the limit is set at 10 for the popular trout and only five for drum, which is considered an incidental catch to many anglers? It’s true that commercial fisherman harvest their share of drum, but apparently not enough to deplete the population.

TPW’s Upper Laguna Madre Program Leader Kyle Spiller calls drum “an under utilized fishery.”

Redfish, on the other hand, are growing in status. Live weigh-in tournaments might deserve some credit for this. We’ve also seen a shift toward catch and release among non-tournament anglers.

Many sightcasters and most fly casters fish for thrills rather than fillets. Nobody knows what percentage of anglers release some or all of the fish they catch. But I feel safe assuming that enough anglers engage in the practice to offset the harvest of a few extra redfish.

I say a few because redfish numbers are growing and statistics show that only a small fraction of Texas anglers actually keep their maximum legal limit of any species. So, you see, the impact of adding a fourth redfish would be minimal, because most anglers never get there. And at current stocks and current harvest rates, the removal of these additional fish certainly would not be enough to harm the population, according to TPW.

Many of you recall that TPW tried adding a redfish before and that the Coastal Conservation Association rejected the proposal soundly. But remember, that suggestion involved adding an oversized fish.

That ill-advised proposal made no sense and was indeed shot down by CCA, along with anglers across the state. Why, after decades of protecting these brood fish, would we accept a measure to kill more of them?

What I’m suggesting is that TPW look at adding a fourth slot-sized redfish and perhaps a slot-sized black drum to our bags. Perhaps CCA would not object to this, if supported by the same science the organization used to arrive at previous positions to restrict harvests of other species.

Why not apply science in the opposite direction? Why not allow the same biological research that resulted in limiting trout and flounder harvests to be applied here, to expand angler opportunity?

Angling opportunity is a common phrase at TPW headquarters. Revenue from fishing licenses pays for lots of conservation and management programs.

Offering us the opportunity to keep an extra fish or two could be seen by anglers as a sign of goodwill from the department. It might even take some of the fishing pressure off trout. There is precedence for this within the department. In 2001, they raised the daily bag on Spanish mackerel from 7 fish to 15. If the species being offered are plentiful, then what’s the harm?

[Tyler]

I can sure see adding one red and a black drum just as long as they are slots.
It would sure kill the idea that if you give into tighter limits, you'll never get them back.

[ironmanstan]

Theres plenty of Drum and Reds....
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I LIKE MINE FRIED.

[GoinCoastal]

Since I am pretty much a catch and release guy, I prefer keeping the limits where they are. And I am all for a statewide 5 fish limit on Specks.

But that's me and I don't keep fish.

[chuck]

i rarely limit out, but if i did hit it good, an extra red/blk drum would sure make meat supply go longer, plus i give some to my folks who can't fish

And i really like red/blk drum grilled & fried it's my favorite. Nothing better

Should the slot size be chaned like 18 to 28? it's different in Louisiana & Florida

[RPool]

Well, as a person that earns his oats being a scientist, there is no doubt that I like the tone and conclusion of the article. By all means, add a redfish and a drum as well. That limits can be successfully increased, with appropriate data to support that move, has been exhaustively demonstrated with migratory bird populations. The best statement in the article is his condemnation of governing arrogantly by the good ole "hunch". As Bertrand Russell once said "The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatever that it is not utterly absurd".

[Lat22]

I'd like to see the slot size on reds start at 18. Those rat reds are tasty (or so I've been told).

[Mad Dog]

Given my skill level and luck the daily bag limit is irrelevant. I am lucky to catch 3 keepers in a weekend much less a day. So my total harvest is not going to change much even if the bag limit is doubled.

However, Mr. Sikes conclussion that if the science justifies a bag limit, it should certainly apply to increases as well as decreases. It seems obvious to me that if we do not apply the "science" in both directions we will create unintended consequences. For instance how would rapidly increasing populations of red and black drum affect the recovery of species we are currently trying to protect (ie. flounder & specks)?

I thinks Mr. Sikes is calling the scientific community to act objectively and with integrity. I don't know that TP&W biologists are doing otherwise but it never hurts to remind them of their mission.

Say loud Dave!

MD
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Ego piscor, ergo sum

http://s175.photobucket.com/albums/w150/cstockton/Aquasport/

[Capt Mike Singleterry]

Hey David if you read this......Who gives a crap what the cca objects to or what they want. If the Texas Parks and Wildlife want to change the
harvest numbers on fish then THEY need to do it.

Mike

[Stump]

I like the idea of adding a red and black drum to the daily limit. It would take some pressure off the specks.
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CARPE DIEM

[knowphish]

I'm pretty much a catch and release guy myself. But, I love coming over to C.C., catching my limit of Reds and Trout, and having them cooked up for my Dad and Sister. If you've never been to the West Coast of Florida..............you can't know how poor the fishing is, in comparison.
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Wanna be Bluffian!! Stay thirsty, my friends!!!!

[freshfish]

I usually only keep one or two anyway but would like to see the slot size opened to 18-28 on the redfish and an extra black drum would be fine....

John
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Nothing makes a fish bigger than almost being caught....

[Big John]

[5moreminutes]

I think if its not broke don't fix it. If its for conservation and there large numbers of redfish why are we not all posting pics of limits of reds? Maybe if the size limits changed maybe more limits??but thats not what was asked in the article.
Blackdrum limits could increase and lower the trout limit to get quality fish. Reading in one article that the trout are making their way up from the lower laguna and seeing fatter trout my last trip out in the Upper Laguna??maybe the lower limit has some effect on quality fish.
Either way I have only caught my limit once on reds? Its all good.
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Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

[larry meinert]

I remember reading somewhere that some bait fish are getting harder to find. Could this be from the artificial hatching of red fish? Maybe they need to increase the limit for this reason, if not, for when the day comes I ever limit out.